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Re: MJ Out Of Pegs Panel

Posted: 12 Dec 2015, 14:38
by NathanOtano
NathanOtano wrote:Hey

Wanted to say thanks again for your panel that I still use really really often.

I created two modified versions that i wanted to share :

[...]_Autostart.tvpx : I modified is so it autostarts when i use a manual flip button. Usefull if you don't need to come back to specific light table value when you stop flipping, if you just always want the value that was set just before flipping.

[...]_Autostart_end.tvpx : this is another version that ends automatically when you go back to your current frame, the aftereefect is that you see your light table in this frame (so it's slower if you out of pegged large resolutions, but if you set the opacity of the light table to 0 before using it it's the same and as fast behaviour as above). But i personnally prefer to see a clean frame when flipping then go back to my light table preset so i don't use it.
Well, I worked more on it and I think the following version is a good compromise.

I modified a lot of things, so now when you begin to flip (no need to hit a button before starting flipping) you don't lose any parameter of your lightable (the lighttable colors that we losed when hitting end, and all the other nonadjacent frames display). And when you come back to the current frame everything is the same as before the OOP Flip, except the global light table opacity that is set to 0 when you begin flipping to avoid lags and be able to flip the current frame without seeing the other frames.
It also works with all the types of lightable modes (not just bookmarks).

At the end if you need to go back to your initial opacity you just clic on the END button (you can still use it if you are on an out of pegged frame, it goes back to current frame). And if you don't hit END you can still work like before when you are back to your current frame (except from the light table opacity set to 0).
+ If you change manually the light table opacity and launch a new OOP flip again, it stores the new value instead of the old one. (in fact each time you begin to flip the current frame with a value that is not 0, it replaces the old value wih the new one)

And "la cerise sur le g√Ęteau" you can put the END button on the same shortcuts you use to flip to automatically escape from the oop flip and restore your light table opacity while moving. (assign the "MJ OOP restore density" button to your usual shortcut, then select your usual shortcut and ctrl+click on assign to have both shortcuts in the right order)

Note : Like so, the MJ OOP scripts can also be used to flip your "current light table mode" (even if you are not out of peg) + desactivating the light table view to flip clearly and without anything to do except using another flip to reactivate your light table and move again.

Lot of work to save some clics and shortcuts... Hope it's usefull.

EDIT : Updated to a V2, i let the V1 available if there is a bug somewhere in the v2.
- Now the script automatically activates the light table on your layer when you start flipping (so if it's turned off now you can start flipping without having to turn it on manually)
- When you click the END button, if your layer was off before your flip, the script automatically switchs it back to off (same behaviour as the opacity of the light table explained above).

Re: MJ Out Of Pegs Panel

Posted: 14 Dec 2015, 23:11
by CartoonMonkey
I wonder, would someone do a screen recording on how exactly you use out of pegs, and this out of pegs panel as you work?

Re: MJ Out Of Pegs Panel

Posted: 15 Dec 2015, 19:56
by NathanOtano
I'll try to do a quick demo soon :) the videos of don perro explains it quiet well." onclick=";return false;

Once you put your inbeetween in the right place, you can use oop to flip it with an offset of your keys. Like if in 3d you removed the translations and rotations (and scale because we are on a computer and not on paper <3) so you can concentrate on more subtle animation by removing the global spacing (mouth that opens and close while the head is also moving for exemple).
And obviously it's a great way to take care of your proportions. You never lose you volumes.

Flipping instead of using the light table with oop is because we want to see motion to better understand how the volumes move and don't just inbeetween lines.

But it's for really subtle and difficult motion, it's a kind of safety guard. For some animations it's a loss of time as it's faster to inbeetween it directly.

Re: MJ Out Of Pegs Panel

Posted: 16 Dec 2015, 00:15
by CartoonMonkey
Awesome thanks Nathan. I can't wait to see your video.


Re: MJ Out Of Pegs Panel

Posted: 17 Dec 2015, 10:03
by Fabrice
ok, I'm waiting for the video too.

Re: MJ Out Of Pegs Panel

Posted: 18 Dec 2015, 08:13
by elmisilhumano
Hard to understand what this can do that Flips panel can't but I'm waiting to see the video too.


Re: MJ Out Of Pegs Panel

Posted: 22 Dec 2015, 18:57
by NathanOtano
elmisilhumano wrote:Hard to understand what this can do that Flips panel can't but I'm waiting to see the video too.

I need three things to be able to use the flip panel to do the same :
- Be able to flip it frame by frame, each click a frame, in one direction or the other, and loop if necessary, to master my timing. (not easy to do because you still have to say when the OOP flip stops)
- Be able to flip the next and previous image of the selected light table mode as steps.
- Be able to change the limits of this flip to the next and previous image of this light table mode. Right know it's only available with frames.

The actual script is still a little slow at the beginning. I was thinking about another way to do it on another temporary layer instead of using the light table, it could speed a lot the flipping process and the OOP transformation if i'm able to avoid the OOP option of the light table.
I was also thinking about using the image library and image guides but I have to wait until the new george commands related to the image library has been developed (here : ... 663#p88663" onclick=";return false;). I think it's the fastest way

Re: MJ Out Of Pegs Panel

Posted: 23 Dec 2015, 00:22
by NathanOtano
I recorded a video with the tvpaint tutorial recorder but half of it isn't readable (after 8 minutes for a 15 minutes video i wanted to edit and accelerate)... Grrr. I'll do it again with a screen capture software and some sound, outside of tvpaint. Sorry i hope it will be done and working soon.

Re: MJ Out Of Pegs Panel

Posted: 15 Jan 2016, 17:25
by D.T. Nethery
NathanOtano wrote:I recorded a video with the tvpaint tutorial recorder but half of it isn't readable (after 8 minutes for a 15 minutes video i wanted to edit and accelerate)... Grrr. I'll do it again with a screen capture software and some sound, outside of tvpaint. Sorry i hope it will be done and working soon.
Thanks for doing that . I know how long it takes to do that sort of thing and it's very frustrating to discover that something did not work correctly during the recording. I look forward to your second version of the OOP tutorial.

Re: MJ Out Of Pegs Panel

Posted: 16 Jan 2016, 18:49
by NathanOtano
Ok here is a video without sound (sorry) where i'm animating a simple head turn with a facial expression change. That's not realistic, and not narrative at all... So don't judge me on that haha.

Here is the final animation :


I tried to be methodical but it was a poor try :D should have prepared it a little more... You'll find some stupid moves and mistakes, I hope it will still be clear, don't hesitate to ask me questions.

I begin with a tied down pose and the other keys rough + a simple time chart (not really timed... I've done it later on the video. It's just random numbers to identify the drawings).
Usually (not in the video) I use image marks to know if a drawing is and extreme, a breakdown, a secondary breakdown/partial drawing or an inbeetween (meaning positions in space, regardless of eases). And then i use line color to set if I have to ease to this line or not (so most of the time I use time charts only if I'm not the one that will finish the animation).

Then in the video I tied down the other two keys using the script. Just to use what I already drew by moving it on the same spot instead of reinventing everything at a different position (in the video I've done that really quickly, sorry for the bad drawings). Usually i put the model sheet directly at the position, rotate and scale of my keys with the image library and i flip it right over the drawing with the toggle diplay guide shortcut.

But the OOP script is especially usefull for the inbeetweens (for the reasons I talked about a few posts earlier). I start inbetweening ar 3:35, after a long fail while trying to draw my breakdown... Typically :
- I begin by flipping my surounding drawings without out of peg (and if you can without lightable on) to draw a rough inbeetween at the right position according to my time chart + arcs
- Then I use the OOP function to put my surounding images near the inbeetween i'm drawing, using a matching point that is the same object on the 3 drawings (for exemple the nose). This way when flipping the drawings will rotate on that point, so choose it carefully
- After that I clean my rough inbeetween and rough a more accurate inbeetween beetween my unpegged drawings with the lightable, still according to my chart but now it's a lot easier and I know my volumes will be better.
- Then i correct this inbeetween by flipping out of peg with the script. You'll notice that when you inbeetweened the lines with the lightable, a lot of times it doesn't seems to work while flipping OOP because you're in fact inbetweening volumes and not lines. You can't do it just with the lightable, you have to flip to see it. (you can also change your oop positions multiple times to concentrate specifically on inbeetweening the eye volume, then the nose volume, then an ear etc...).
- You can also inbeetween secondary keys in the expressions for exemple, it's now really easy to do.
- You'll see that i flip unpegged but also pegged (thanks to the modified version that ends automatically the lightable isn't visible), to see also the look of my animation in the final animation. Then if i need to see my lightable again I just use the third button to restore it.

If it's still isn't clear, I'll try to do a video while explaining with my voice next time (and maybe by cliking on the buttons of the script instead of using shortcuts and at normal speed). But i would prefer to do it while explaining my whole animation workflow with tvpaint.

Note :
I have to correct the script so my eraser don't goes to the color mode after flipping, it's a bug in a function (that's why you'll see a lot of big accidental strokes...).