multiply layer

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hisko
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multiply layer

Post by hisko » 05 Apr 2007, 09:49

Dear developers,

I have just explored the tvpaint-demo and I am seriously planning to buy the pro-version, so I can make my new film entirely in tvpaint. Allthough I already enjoy your program there is one big reason for me to wait with buying, because there is no multiply-option for the layers and I need that to make very advanced shadows in a natural way.
Peter Wassink, whom you all know probably, is planning to design a brush resembling the digital watercolorbrush from painter 10. But in order to do that we need an option to put a layer in multiply mode.
I have seen that you already are planning to work on that, so I hope that it will be in the new version of tv-paint.
I attached a photoshop-file, so that you can see how my characters are build up, using a multiply layer in. I already use Peter Wassink's pencil, which works wonderful for the sort of drawings that I make, but the rest was done in painter 10.

Best regards, Hisko Hulsing
Attachments
paul15a-2.tvp
This is how it looks like in tvpaint. I know that there is way to merge layers and multiply them, but I need immediate multiplication when I'm painting it.
(1.57 MiB) Downloaded 559 times
paul15a-2.jpg
This is the picture the way it should look like (unfortunately I couldn't upload a photoshop file incl. layers)
paul15a-2.jpg (243.49 KiB) Viewed 14848 times

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TVPaint
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Post by TVPaint » 05 Apr 2007, 12:03

Dear Hisko,
Welcome on our forum and thank you for your your interest in our softwares.
The real-time layer blending is not possible yet, that's true.
Although please note that we already have our development plannings set for the future versions and you could have good surprises...

Very nice art btw :)

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malcooning
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Post by malcooning » 12 Apr 2007, 13:34

Hisko,

in the mean time, why don't you create the image in tvpaint, and use layer transparencies and brush transparencies to create the same look? between all users of tvpaint we have quite impressive brushes. I have tried a few times to paint in painter, but I always end up getting back to tvpaint, because I feel the brushes that I use fell more natural to me. If you're interested, I can send you some of the brushes I use.

but if you still prefer to create in photoshop/painter and then import it to tvpaint, there are a few ways of achieving the same look:

1. import all your frames from photoshop/painter, and then apply the multiply layer onto the colour layer with keyframer set on 'multiply'
-or-
2. drag the multiply layer icon onto the colour layer icon, and choose 'multiply' from the drop down menu of the pop up window.
-or-
3. apply the FX colour->Scan Cleaner to the whole of the multiply layer, which turns all white information in the layer to transparency. it then behaves like a normal multiply layer, and you can play with the layer opacity. I recommend to use this method if you import PSD files as frames.

I know it's still a compromise, but we are all eagerly waiting for some 'blending modes' action in next releases :)

hisko
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multiply

Post by hisko » 03 May 2007, 20:20

Hi,
Thanks a lot for the replies. I have been too busy lately to respond.
Malcooning, I am interested in your brushes of course, so if you could send me some I would be very grateful. I am also curious about your artwork too.
The use of layertransparencies and brushtransparencies though is not a solution for me. I use opaque colors underneath my lines and then I really need a multiply-layer for the shadows, beacuse with a normal transparencymode, every time a brushstroke is stopped, the new brushstroke that overlaps will look darker and besides that, a dark brown shadow will make a black area look lighter instead of darker. I know there are other ways to achieve the effect that I want, but those work-arounds will take too much time for a fully animated realistic 15 minute film and they will affect my intuitive way of working too much (I want to see what I am painting the moment I'm painting it).
So actually I really do need a multiply-layer, and I hope that there will be a new version that has that feature (any news about that?).

Hisko
www.hiskohulsing.com

malinkey
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Joined: 08 Mar 2011, 20:29

Re: multiply layer

Post by malinkey » 01 Sep 2012, 11:06

Hello HISKO,

First of all, let me tell you how impressed i am with samples i saw of your film Junkyard. Very very well done, i love it.
I was wondering if you could take me to your process of colouring, settings, lighting ? I am very interested to get an idea of how you managed to get this quality.
I am an animation director myself and for my next project, im still looking for rendering a painting feel. I have ideas but would take so very long. That is why i am asking you, maybe it'll help me see things i idnt think of ?
Of course you can say no. I would understand :)
I already tried some of the step by step images example available in the tvp website, but for some reason, i dont get the same final. Maybe i dont get some settings ?

PS: do not worry, my intention is not to copy your colouring style, but to understand it, as a start. If you see what i mean.

Best to you,

http://www.malikawhitaker.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

hisko
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Re: multiply layer

Post by hisko » 02 Sep 2012, 15:29

Hi Malika,

Right now I don´t have the time to explain it in great detail.
You can see samples of linetests, shading and coloring here:

http://www.hiskohulsing.com/animated-fi ... linetests/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

and there is more overall information on
http://www.hiskohulsing.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

But in short, the coloring for the characters was done flat in tvpaint. Then I used the lighting effect (one ambient lighting and the some spots). and then I painted the shadows frame by frame on top of that in a multiplylayer using a simple watercolourbrush that I once made. You can download it somewhere here from the forum.

I painted all backgrounds with real oilpaint on canvas and photographed them. The lighting and painting of the shadows on the characters in tvpaint was done to make sure that they fit perfectly in the oilpaintbackgrounds
We used clayheads that I made for the character animation, as well as liveactionshots for the bodies of the characters.

hisko
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Re: multiply layer

Post by hisko » 02 Sep 2012, 15:31

You can download the brush here:
http://forum.tvpaint.com/viewtopic.php? ... lor#p38712" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

hisko
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Re: multiply layer

Post by hisko » 02 Sep 2012, 15:34

One more thing:

I did the shadowpainting of the characters in one layer (as opposed to the sample, which was too laborious), and just skipped between drawings to make sure it wasn´t too wobbly.

One last thing:
Don´t do this at home!!

It took years of my life and now people write that I used 3d software to simply sort of project it.... or something like that...
sigh...

malinkey
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Joined: 08 Mar 2011, 20:29

Re: multiply layer

Post by malinkey » 03 Sep 2012, 04:56

OMG !!!

I can't tell you enough how pleased i am you replied this quickly !! and this much
Thank you so much for all the infos and advice.
For my own project, i was also gonna use liveaction shots. I did the same as you : one layer for flatcolour adding some lights and spots. then another layer for shadows or hit lights ( depending) in flat color as well and blured it this layer. but it gives it a sence of "cold". i need to work out how to get this painting feel without loosing too much time on it ( it's gonna be a 1h30min long...) So your way can maybe open my eyes on new stuff i can end up with ? I'll see.

If people think you used some 3D, only means you did the best job ever !! ( i personaly didnt think that at all.)
When is the film out ? Im sure it's gonna be a hugh succes ! As it looks so amazing.
Im impressed by your talent
caring on the great work !! it will certainly be rewarded !

best
Malika

hisko
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Re: multiply layer

Post by hisko » 03 Sep 2012, 06:56

Thanks!

Junkyard premiered in Annecy and will now be screened in competition in Ottawa and many more filmfestivals.
It will be the Dutch entry for the Oscars.

Elodie
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Re: multiply layer

Post by Elodie » 03 Sep 2012, 09:17

hisko wrote:It will be the Dutch entry for the Oscars.
I hope Junkyard will go to the Oscar's ceremony and will make you win a golden statuette ;)

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slowtiger
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Re: multiply layer

Post by slowtiger » 24 Sep 2012, 07:29

This morning on Cartoonbrew.com:

2012 Ottawa International Animation Festival
Nelvana GRAND PRIZE for Best Independent Short Animation
Junkyard directed by Hisko Hulsing, Netherlands

Congratulations!
TVP 10.0.18, Mac Pro Quadcore 3 GHz, 16 GB RAM, OS 10.11, QT 7.7.3

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Fabrice
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Re: multiply layer

Post by Fabrice » 24 Sep 2012, 08:44

Congrat Hisko :)
Fabrice Debarge

Elodie
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Re: multiply layer

Post by Elodie » 24 Sep 2012, 09:56

Congratulations !!! :D :D :D

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Léo
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Re: multiply layer

Post by Léo » 24 Sep 2012, 11:28

Congratulations!!! :mrgreen:
Léo Fernandez
http://www.tvpaint.com

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